Also I use a certain account to top up multiple investment accounts like FreeTrade (and others). I donāt do crypto so thatās out of the picture. Or should I say Iāve bought bitcoin once on Revolut, but thatās it really.
Also since Iām mostly a but and hold investor, the number of withdrawal s is vastly less than deposits.
Is it worth charging something to that banks card every now and then.
At least FreeTrade and all other stockbrokers are FCA regulated businesses unlike many crypto platforms.
The same way all major banks make money. Interest, commissions, overdraft fees, loans, card transaction fees, premium membership ā¦
The difference for the model is they donāt offer some of the more premium features that major banks up sell to current account customers like credit cards and mortgages.
From the outside, and not knowing that @Rollingskies is a stand up person of high character, itās not hard to see why some who only sends money in to send it straight onto a crypto exchange would trigger an AML flag. Given Monzo have been under pressure for their onboarding and AML compliance theyāre more sensitive that existing banks.
Iāve used Monzo since the days of prepaid cards & topped up my Coinbase account upwards of 30 times without issue because itās just one transaction among normal spending.
I have loads of crypto transactions on my Monzo account. Butā¦ Iām also a plus member, have a loan, FX fees etc. so Iām probably too profitable to shut down. It is worrying what they are doing. I donāt think their algorithm is up to scratch and the lifetime value of a single cancelled user could run into the thousands or even tens of thousands for a bank.
Also, Binanceās P2P crypto trading system works quite well. Then you just have bank transfers from random members of the public rather than Coinbase, Binance etc. I donāt know if banks consider this more or less suspicious but itās an option
I really doubt theyāre shutting down accounts that arenāt profitable, itāll be an AML flag that youāre account doesnāt trigger due to more datapoints
Unlikely due to an account making them money or not. They will have a boat load of accounts that were created just to take advantage of the cash referral incentives. Other startups with similar incentives would have the same problem. Those accounts provide the Bank a chance to try to convince them to use the account, closing the account would just alienate them.
Anyway, like others have said itās more than likely due to the account acting as a link between HSBC and Binance. But to add to that, the cadence and timings of the transfers might have triggered this.
We arent even talking of much in the grand scheme of things. Maybe 20 or 30k max and its only out, im not transferring life changing amounts or anything. So no money coming back from binance.
There is not a single reason i can honestly think of. So it can only be money. They dont want me as a customer. I dont know why I feel so offended, almost like I feel they deserve me! If they wanted some fees and were up front Iād have probably happily paid a premium fee - though eventually may have looked elsewhere.
I feel obliged to take a premium package now with revolut so they feel Im worthwhile.
20-30k would be a life changing amount for a lot of people. It 100% seems like a large enough amount that it could be flagged for money laundering too.
Like I said before I use my monzo in the same way, but my transactions are maybe one or two hundred at a time, so I guess they would be way less likely to be flagged.
Re the 20-30k number, bear in mind that a lot of AML stuff is geared towards money mules.
These are people that lend their account to nefarious people, often without realising they are doing so.
Crypto is a perfect product for criminals that use money mules - as they can get the mule to buy crypto and send it to their address anonymously. Before crypto, someone that used mules would have to withdraw the money to cash or move it offshore before a bank clawed back the money.
The long short is, because crypto transactions do not go through verifiable entities that conduct the same KYC as a FCA regulated entity, banks legally have to be suspicious. And Ā£20-30k over 1000 mules isnāt a small sum anymore.
Just to be crystal clear - Iām of course not suggesting you have done anything wrong at all, or even remotely out of the ordinary. Just that crypto can spook banks (for good reason).
The FCA is slowly but surely mandating crypto exchanges conduct proper KYC to operate in the UK, which is excellent for those people that would like to invest in crypto as they can do so from whitelisted businesses without fear of banks treating those transactions as suspicious (hopefully )
For the record I donāt think accounts are getting shutdown because they are unprofitable. It might be that if a valuable account gets flagged a human will look at it before coming down with the banhammer vs getting shut straight down by the algo
Please make sure there are no more comment on race wether you find them āinterestingā or not. The moderators will only have to shut the thread down. This includes you Junoās alt account
Just one note here, a Monzo staff member commented on their forum within the past 12 months, that every single account closure has human eyes review it. There isnāt a process where a computer flags AND closes - a human will always review before a decision is made.
Personally I canāt imagine revenue comes into it at all - if their financial crime team has an account come across their desk, theyāre weighing up risk. The financial crime team isnāt going to change their risk rating because they pay for Monzo Plus, or have Ā£50k in pots. Risk is a tricky thing to measure, but i canāt see why revenue would reduce risk.
It would have been nice if theyd opened up an investigation. Come and investiagte me. Ill happily prove where all my money has come from. Its all taxed!!
I just feel disappointed that if it wasnt a money reason that theyād just look at my account and treat me like some money laundering crook witbout a shred of evidence. Hmrc tax crypto. They dont tax gambling. Crypto is not a criminal activity nor is it even in the vice category.
Id have happily sent them my bank statements if they were concerned. If they think im a crook I hope theyāve reported me.
I just suspect they havent reported me and its a business decision. But the concensus here is that it isnāt.
However, anyone here can read this, so i expect theyll now be more likely to open an account with revolut instead. I also will be telling everyone at work recommending revolut over monzo. Oh and my clients. Ill be telling them monzo shut me down for no reason too.
Most things in life come down to money. Im still gravitating to that as the reason.
However, Monzo will be losing out big time if this is their way of doing business
The problem is they canāt tell you about the investigation, it would then be tipping off and subject to fines and potential criminal prosecution for both colleagues and business.
From what youāve described, working in that field, it more than likely will be due to falling outwith the risk appetite for the business - probably specifically AML concerns.
Again this is speculation, but just an educated guess.
Except millions of people own crypto in the uk alone and none of them do it with cash. There are loads of exchanges and hundreds of thousands of users too. If that wasnt enough the numbers who are getting into thr space, including monzo users, are increasing every day.
Oh well.
I seem to be alone in here. Il crawl back under my rock.
Completely understandable where youāre coming from and your point of view - it wonāt be purely due to the usage of crypto but rather the full usage of the account and how it aligns to what is typically seen as part of money laundering/fraud patterns.
Rightly or wrongly, banks are always under heightened scrutiny nowadays. The risks of not complying with regulations sadly far outweighs giving benefit of doubt.
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